IRC log from THATCamp 2008

by Amanda French Categories: Administrative, Collaboration

Thought I’d post a bit of history: the IRC (Internet Relay Channel) log from the first THATCamp in 2008, presciently saved by Bess Sadler. We do still have a room called thatcamp on the IRC channel at, but Twitter has taken over much of the function that IRC then served. Do feel free to use the thatcamp IRC channel whenever you like!

I’ve edited the log so that it can be more easily read, taking out all the lines about so-and-so leaving or joining the IRC. Enjoy.

— Log opened Sat May 31 10:19:27 2008
10:19 < epistemographer> just imagine if we were all piling on one collaborative spreadsheet
10:19 < asolove> so can whoever controls thatcampbot consider the room-specific IRC channels?
10:19 < thatcampbot> ok
10:20 < jgsmith> a wiki page for the schedule?
10:21 < thatcampbot> give me a sec to figure this out
10:21 < dancohen> is it possible to simultaneously irc chat, twitter, blog, and podcast? I’m going to try.
— Log opened Sat May 31 10:26:08 2008
10:29 < asolove> thatcamp450 for rdf discussion
10:30 < willynills> about to start the text mining session
10:31 < DruidSmith> RDF… am curious if anyone is working with AJAX or JavaScript browsing and navigation of OWL ontologies
10:34 < willynills> text analysis software:
10:35 < willynills> philomine:
10:37 < dancohen> in the text mining session in the lab (rm 462)
10:39 < dancohen> sean takats is explaining CHNM’s upcoming NEH-funded text-mining project
10:40 < epistemographer> Sean’s not a “better” historian, he’s a “different” kind of historian
10:40 < dchud> dancohen: hooray for funding ๐Ÿ™‚
10:41 < bess_> the techies are having an impromptu “keeping the wheels on” meeting — sustainability from a technical point of view
10:42 < dancohen> good thing we’re inside–just got a tornado watch alert from the fairfax messaging system, active until 10:30 tonight
10:42 < epistemographer> yowza
10:42 < doug_knox> RDF group talking about bibliographic data, citations, Zotero, data about museum/library objects
10:43 < willynills> according sean: three aspects of text mining: locating or finding documents, automatically extracting data from documents (instead of manually reading), analysis of corpus
10:45 < willynills> according to laura mandell: text mining can be used to identify terms of analysis not within your discipline
10:45 < matthewgaventa> wow. really doesn’t LOOK like tornado weather (at least through my small window)
10:46 < jackflaps> it feels like it, though
10:48 < davelester> it’s great to see everyone on IRC!
10:51 < elli> RDF: used to define relationships in restricted domains, perhaps more interesting. But movement in developing it is to make it applicable to broader and broader domains.
10:52 < bess_> davelester: I set up thatcampbot to record the channel. I’ll give you the logs afterwards.
10:52 < davelester> thanks bess_ ๐Ÿ™‚
10:56 < asolove> can someone add thatcampbot to thatcamp450
10:56 < davelester> asolove++ great idea. can you do that bess_?
10:57 < willynills> dan cohen: text mining tools need to useful for historians and may not be
10:58 < willynills> text mining tasks: summarization, classification, extractions
10:59 < bess_> asolove and davelester : I’ll give it a shot
10:59 < bess_> asolove and davelester : I’ll get to it on the break, I’m in the middle of a good conversation
10:59 < davelester> np
11:03 < asolove> ok thanks
11:06 < karindalziel> I will be posting the URL’s we are talking about on with tag thatcamp
11:07 < jackflaps> I’m going to start doing that for the RDF session as well
11:10 < willynills> text mining does more than speed up historical thought; it should give us a new level of comprehension
11:11 < clioweb> FYI – I updated the schedule, so that should be current based on the last change we tried to implement downstairs
11:11 < clioweb> thanks to everyone for patience and input
11:11 < clioweb> schedule at
11:12 < dancohen> clioweb: thanks–you did a great job with the schedule; hard to optimize something that complicated
11:12 < clioweb> I think it worked out well
11:13 < davelester> clioweb++
11:14 < clioweb> people should feel free to use other rooms and spaces for ad hoc meetings
11:20 < BenBrumfield> Karin, is there any chance you could let us use your wiki?
11:25 < karindalziel> ben – sure, pass is karin
11:25 < karindalziel> I’ll clean up later
11:29 < dancohen>
11:30 < dancohen> my best effort on text mining + geolocation
11:32 < BenBrumfield> Karin, can you paste the URL?
11:35 < BenBrumfield> Got it
11:35 < davelester> could people post their session notes on the blog? that’d be great
11:35 < dancohen> so far, been able to blog, tweet, and irc chat all at once; adding in the podcasting might be hard…
11:36 < DruidSmith> There was a GREAT discussion of technology and sustainability at EPA’s Science Forum last week – William McDonough, author of The Cradle to Cradle Revolution –
11:37 < davelester> dancohen: I’d love to see a live digital campus ๐Ÿ™‚
11:37 < epistemographer> me too – do it, Dan ๐Ÿ™‚
11:37 < karindalziel> actually, just set up a new wiki
11:37 < dancohen> davelester: tom and I were thinking of doing it
11:37 < BenBrumfield> Oh. Sweet!
11:38 < dancohen> anyone mind if I look like I’m manning a McDonald’s drive-thru?
11:38 < BenBrumfield> Well, I need a place to put the DorkShorts material now, so I’ll get started with Karin’s
11:38 < davelester> there’s already a whiteboard in the main room for dork shorts with a list of names
11:38 < karindalziel> feel free to do whatever you want there
11:43 < willynills> Bill: text mining, given abundant texts, can ask questions about simultaneity and co-incidence.
11:43 < sgillies> epiphany!
11:44 < DruidSmith> add geotagging to the mix and you also have geo-enabled text mining ๐Ÿ™‚
11:45 < DruidSmith> and temporal coincidence / simultaneity?
11:50 < asolove> what is the method for getting slides in to Dork Shorts?
11:51 < BenBrumfield> Karin, can you enable uploads on the wiki?
11:52 < foundhistory> asolove … thumbdrive?
11:53 < asolove> hmm
11:53 < asolove> I can just download from email
11:53 < foundhistory> if that works. what kind of slides? ppt? keynote?
11:53 < BenBrumfield> Will we be able to hook up the projector to our own laptops?
11:53 < asolove> it’s actually just xul
11:54 < foundhistory> oh
11:54 < foundhistory> np
11:54 < foundhistory> ben… that’s going to be tough
11:54 < foundhistory> we’re going to be pretty pressed for time
11:54 < BenBrumfield> Okay — wiki it is
11:54 < foundhistory> but we could add another dork shorts session maybe
11:55 < sgillies> session 1 made me think of “glass house”
11:56 < foundhistory> Lunch is served!!!
11:56 < foundhistory> and Dork Shorts is starting!
12:00 < sgillies> great adhoc session in 402. thanks, everybody
12:13 < karindalziel> lunch is teh awesome. Great spreat, guys!!
12:22 < sgillies> syndication architecture ++
12:29 < asolove> lunch was excellent
12:33 < epistemographer> omeka in action:
12:37 < dancohen> enjoying the dork shorts
12:39 < bess__> oooh, pretty! typographia
12:41 < bess__> can anyone read the url?
12:42 < jackflaps>
12:42 < jeanne_kramer-sm>
12:47 -!- Netsplit < -> quits: asolove, karindalziel, bess__, bess_, matthewgaventa, epistemographer, jgsmith, dancohen, sgillies
12:53 -!- Netsplit over, joins: dancohen
12:53 -!- Netsplit over, joins: sgillies
12:54 -!- Netsplit over, joins: epistemographer
12:55 -!- Netsplit over, joins: bess_
12:58 < travis> Collaborative annotation:
13:02 < tjowens> #thatcamp401
13:02 < tjowens> doh
13:06 < dancohen> In session on search, listening to Karin Dalziel show some interesting, wide-ranging examples.
13:07 < sgillies> i’d never seen etsy
13:07 < sgillies> nice
13:08 < bess_> etsy++
13:10 < bess_> All of the stuff Karin’s talking about is also available at
13:13 < tjowens> learning about iggy pop’s beat down
13:14 < sgillies> etsy beer can hat:
13:14 < jackflaps> cleveland rocks
13:16 < davelester>
13:17 < dancohen> davelester: thanks, dave.
13:17 < tjowens> that better not be atsly
13:17 < bess_> Josh G. says “It’s all about leveraging solipsism.” Love it!
13:17 < asolove> that’s cruel
13:33 < jeanne_kramer-sm>
13:36 < erazlogo> crowdsource transcribing first, then present like this:
13:41 < davelester> twitter is down again? boo
13:44 < asolove> the rain must have gotten it
13:46 < bess_> omg the rain!
13:46 < jackflaps> twitter’s a little slow
13:46 < jackflaps> if you poke at it with sticks a little it eventually loads
14:06 < epistemographer> we got crazy geeky in the Search session
14:12 < jeanne_kramer-sm> hoping that folks might post what was discussed in the Search session on the wiki…
14:14 < nowviskie> lisa spiro takes kick-ass notes and will be sharing a summary of the “research methods” session on the blog.
15:00 < epistemographer> quick call out: what’s being talked about in the sessions people are in?
15:01 < epistemographer> in “Museums” we’re talking about the difference between how museums, libraries and archives approach digita vs. physical issues
15:03 < jackflaps> in Games we’re talking about how to evaluate history-based video games based on their value as teaching tools
15:50 < dancohen>
15:51 < shekhar> is patrick in here?
16:08 < dancohen> sustainability has been moved to rm 450
16:11 < BenBrumfield> Dorkshorts is nearly empty. We’ll probably wrap up early.
16:12 < davelester> aw
16:28 < elli> open street maps project offers lots of potential for dh projects to create maps for their own purposes (historical, not street based, available)
16:37 < bess___> elli: would you please post any notes you have on historical applications for open street maps? I was sorry to miss that session.
16:38 < shekhar> bess___: we’re not talking about historical maps in OSM… yet…
16:39 < shekhar>
16:39 < elli> bess_: I”ll do my best,
16:43 < elli> Now we are discussing how you might use the technology to walk places and map traces of roads, settlements, battlegrounds, and use the OSM software to incorporate this information
16:45 < dancohen> discussing sustainability models for zotero
16:46 < dancohen> anyone who is not in rm 450 who has ideas, drop them into IRC or Twitter
16:46 < elli> Mapping: site with links to open source mapping software
16:49 < elli> Mapping: Shekhar is showing a free map of Mumbai with historical layers overlaid from the freemap site.
17:00 < bess___> I’ve heard a bit about processing, but I had no idea how awesome it was. What a great session!
17:05 * shekhar just showed and the testing version of a zotero openstreetmap plugin
19:30 < davelester> howdy all
19:34 < kerri> Hi Dave. Wish I was there. ๐Ÿ™
19:35 < davelester> aw, maybe next year? ๐Ÿ˜€
19:36 < kerri> ๐Ÿ™‚ Sounds like it has been great!
19:36 < kerri> Elli will surely debrief me when she returns.
19:37 < davelester> definitely
19:51 < cg_> #thatcamp port 7000 at GMU.
19:51 < cg_> #thatcamp port 7000 at GMU
21:45 < bess_> hello?
21:53 < karindalziel> hiya. I am just hanging out in here while working on a blog post. ๐Ÿ™‚
22:03 < karindalziel> soooo….is everyone else exhausted, or is it just me?
22:21 < bess_> karindalziel: also exhausted
22:21 < bess_> karindalziel: it’s so great to meet you! We have a lot of the same research interests.
22:22 < karindalziel> I am somehow wired too. Brain is racing. Which is good!
22:22 < karindalziel> bess: Great to meet you too!
22:23 < karindalziel> I feel like I have SO much to learn.
22:23 < bess_> karindalziel: You might enjoy this paper:
22:24 < bess_> It’s an interface I worked on while at U of Alberta.
22:24 < bess_> Stan Ruecker was the primary investigator, and if you don’t know his work you might also enjoy it…
22:24 < karindalziel> cool- thanks! Something to read ont he plane ride home. ๐Ÿ™‚
22:26 < karindalziel> Are you leading any discussions tomorrow?
22:26 < bess_> no, I don’t think so
22:26 < bess_> I plan to be an “active participant” in the omeka one, though!
22:27 < karindalziel> I can’t decide betwen that and interface design. So many tough choices.
22:27 < bess_> oh damn, did they schedule those across from each other?
22:28 * bess_ runs off to check the schedule
22:29 < bess_> Dammit, I want to attend every single one of the first sessions
22:30 < bess_> I mean the second session
22:30 < karindalziel> I know. :/
22:30 < bess_> I’m sure all the first sessions will be great, too, but mashup is the only one for me. ๐Ÿ™‚
22:30 < karindalziel> Hopefully people will blog their sessions/
22:30 < bess_> but GIS, interface design, omeka, and bibliographic standards… I’m working on every one of those right now. ๐Ÿ™
22:31 < karindalziel> I will go to management since it pertains most to my job. Unless I change my mind tomorrow morning.
22:31 < bess_> management? really? what kind of management?
22:32 < karindalziel> Project management.. lemme go find link
22:32 < karindalziel>
22:35 < karindalziel> geez, linking blog posts takes forever
22:36 < karindalziel> hi ben
22:41 < karindalziel> Done with THAT Camp day 1 recap
22:41 < karindalziel>
22:41 < karindalziel> and with that, off to read for a bit before bed. *yawn*
22:41 < sgillies> anybody else got a 5:11 flight from dulles and want to share a cab? lemme know
22:43 < karindalziel> hope I didn’t get anyone’s name wrong.
22:43 < sgillies> good recap
22:43 < karindalziel> wow, you’re quick!
22:43 < karindalziel> ok, really going now. ๐Ÿ™‚
22:44 < jeanne_ks> where is the recap?
22:45 < sgillies>
22:46 < jeanne_ks> thanks!
22:46 < sgillies> see you all in the morning
22:53 < davelester> anyone in #thatcamp coming to the ‘hacking omeka’ session tomorrow? I’m still deciding what I want to show
22:55 < bess_> davelester: I’ll be there
22:55 < davelester> nice, I saw your tweet
22:56 < davelester> I’ll definitely show off the OAI-PMH ingestion plugin
22:56 < bess_> davelester: NYPL and UVA are both very interested in how we can bring digital repository objects into omeka exhibits.
22:56 < bess_> davelester: I’d also like some advice on how to get started writing omeka themes and plugins
22:57 < bess_> davelester: I think the more eyecandy themes we can provide for omeka the more people will oooh and ahhh. ๐Ÿ™‚
22:57 < davelester> agreed!
22:58 < bess_> davelester: I’m really looking forward to it, but now I have to go to sleep so I can wake up on time. See you tomorrow!
23:15 < jeanne_ks> Having trouble deciding ‘Hacking Omeka’ vs ‘GIS/Maps’ vs ‘Interface Design’!
— Day changed Sun Jun 01 2008
07:11 < dchud> mornin’
07:11 < dchud> how do i see what everybody has twittered to @thatcamp all at once?
07:44 < sgillies> morning
09:14 < sgillies> asolove breaking free of xml!
10:09 < asolove> text session has been interesting
10:10 < bess__> mashup session is fascinating.
10:10 < asolove> what was covered?
10:10 < elli> what was covered in text?
10:10 < asolove> just using Yahoo/Google/Simile tools, or something additional?
10:11 < elli> mashups talked more about APIs, permanence and guidelines for APIs, and not so much about tools and implementations.
10:11 < asolove> uh huh
10:11 < asolove> we discussed some uses and issues with TEI, alternate storage formats
10:11 < elli> (importance of spending the time to develop APIs and make available)
10:12 < asolove> and cool graphical interfaces for creating digital texts without knowing XML
10:12 < elli> what alternate storage formats
10:12 < asolove> very interesting
10:13 < bess__> asolove: we’re talking about everything from google maps, to library of congress web services, to the importance of permanent urls and the implications for scholarship
10:14 < bess__> excellent conversation, I’m generating way more ideas than I’ll possibly be able to implement
10:14 < asolove> sounds very interesting, sorry I had to present this round
10:15 < bess__> asolove: I get the feeling there will be lots of blog posts and writeups about this one
10:15 < elli> Raymond closed with programmableweb,com
10:36 < jkramer_ks> fyi.. I posted a summary of the Text Mining session from yesterday:
10:41 < asolove> INTERFACE DESIGN IN 401
10:41 < asolove> whoops
10:43 < epistemographer> asolove: what’s the discussion about in 401?
10:43 < asolove> funny
10:43 < asolove> I think we’re looking at the JGAAP interface
10:46 < nowviskie> can’t believe I didn’t realize you can put a URL to a KML file like this in the search blank for Google Maps!
10:46 < nowviskie>
10:47 < bess_> nowviskie: wow! I didn’t know you could do that either!
10:49 < nowviskie> yeah, bess — guess what’s going to be on Joe’s to-do list when we get home! ๐Ÿ™‚
10:49 < elli> Bibliograph session
10:50 < elli> I mean Bibliography
10:50 < elli> Zotero is a good tool for moving bibliographic information from one place to another
10:51 < elli> Bruce D’Arcus style language for bib (CSL)
10:51 < dchud> bibliograph(y or ic) ๐Ÿ™‚
10:52 < nowviskie> re: mashing up georeferenced data — this also works in Google Maps:
10:52 < dancohen> if the biblio group would like me to come over to 450, let me know
10:52 < elli> we have Trevor here!
10:53 < dancohen> ok, just checking
10:53 < erazlogo> for future thatcamp – find software for all urls opened in all sessions to be automatically saved into one big links file (coins-enabled?) so people could later follow links from sessions they missed
10:55 < elli> zotero/content/tools/csleit.xul
10:59 < bess_> nowviskie: maybe we could give David G. access to the google sat imagery that way… allow people to export a kml file of the layer he wants and open it in google maps / google earth
11:00 < dchud> tjowens: note the second author at
11:05 < dancohen> in the interface design session (rm 401) we’re debating how much to ask users what a good UI is for a tool or collection
11:07 < jgsmith> re ui: unix tends to optimize for the most common use case, which is the experienced user — explains why man pages tend to be cryptic for those unfamiliar with a particular command
11:08 < dancohen> jgsmith: right. good point.
11:10 < bess_> in the omeka hacking talk we’re making unreasonable demands of the omeka dev team
11:10 < davelester___> ๐Ÿ™‚
11:11 < dchud> jgsmith: does unix optimize for the most common use case, or the simplest, decomposed, filterable use case?
11:11 < asolove> it optimizes for the case of people who have write access to the man page in a project
11:11 < bess_> asolove++ # so true!
11:12 < jgsmith> well, most people using unix are experienced in unix — the inexperience period is short compared to the rest of a person’s career
11:12 < matthewgaventa> nice parallel: in bibliography, we’re bordering on making unreasonable demands on the zotero team
11:12 < bess_> matthewgaventa: I’m going to make my unreasonable demands during the lunchtime zotero session
11:13 < jgsmith> doesn’t mean an interface should be poorly designed — but designed for the person familiar with the process or the concepts involved
11:13 < asolove> the design might encourage users to learn the underlying system
11:14 < jgsmith> asolove: -nod- — easier to do in a GUI than a CLI
11:15 < dancohen> note to people making unreasonable demands of CHNMers: don’t make us release the hounds on you.
11:18 < epistemographer> unreasonable demands++
11:19 < dancohen> and Yahoo UI provide open source nice-looking widgets for websites
11:19 < dancohen> that are tested across many browsers
11:20 < epistemographer> for reference: URL I demo-ed is
11:40 < bess_> OAI/PMH plugin for omeka is fantastic. I’ve never cared deeply about OAI before, but I think I just started.
11:42 < elli>
11:50 < erazlogo> use for upcoming mapping plugin in zotero–map your research trips by where archives are located–could be done if there is an archival collection item type with a “place” field
11:58 < dchud>
12:21 < davelester_> Lightning talks: first up, Mark Tebeau presenting the Euclid Corridor
12:28 < matthewgaventa> next up in dork shorts: jeffrey talking about CSS file structure and organization
12:37 < asolove> dancohen is about to start the zotero demo
12:39 < matthewgaventa> dave lester is talking about scholarpress
12:41 < asolove> zotero demo starting
12:49 < elli> Goodbye and thank you to everyone at ThatCamp, enjoy the rest of the day. It’s been great camping with you all.
12:49 < asolove> leaving early?
12:50 < sgillies> cheers, elli. great to meet you
12:50 < elli> yes. have to take a train. It’s been great to meet you, too.
12:53 < asolove> Twitter seems to be down
12:53 < asolove> just thing
12:53 < asolove> Jobs at WWDC, Cohen announcing Zotero server
13:20 < karindalziel> The librarians on twitter are asking me lots of questions about Zotero server. Much excitement. ๐Ÿ™‚
13:32 < dancohen__> good visualizations anyone? post them to IRC
13:33 < jgsmith> – Tufte’s done a lot of work on data visualization in general
13:34 < asolove_> Interesting discussion of event microformat standard
13:35 < asolove_> and now the event discussion is moving into visualization issues and we ought to be talking to the people in 402
13:36 < dancohen__> hey people talking about time in rm 462: why not join us in rm 402?
13:37 < asolove_> winds changed and now we’re into interdisciplinary discussion
13:39 < dchud> if only we could fold time and space. and then visualize that.
13:41 < dancohen__> come on down!
13:42 < dchud> somehow i read that as “interplanetary”
13:44 < asolove> whoops, misunderstood visualization
13:48 < karindalziel> asolove: What did you think visualization meant?
13:49 < asolove> I thought we were talking about GIS type issues and graphing not quick display of information
13:50 < karindalziel> asolove:ah, OK
14:02 < bess__> we solved all our problems in the international issues session, so we’ve dispersed to other sessions
21:27 < shekhar> any thatcampers want to grab a drink in DC?
21:28 * shekhar opens a beer for thatcampbot
22:02 < davelester> hey shekhar, where in DC are you at? I’m in Arlington right now
22:14 < shekhar> davelester: i’m in columbia heights
22:14 < shekhar> a bit far, i imagine
22:14 * shekhar passes the pipe to omeka-bot
— Day changed Mon Jun 02 2008
14:03 < davelester> sgillies and jgsmith: great to meet you both this weekend!
14:03 < davelester> hope you enjoyed #thatcamp
14:04 < sgillies> davelester: it rocked
14:04 < sgillies> i have a feeling that good things will ripple out of it
— Day changed Tue Jun 03 2008

RCHN Mellon Mellon